Advice for a newbie on a Devlin repair/restoration

Richard S

Member
Hi folks, I've been reading posts and admiring the craftsmanship of those on this forum for a number of years. I'm happy to say I recently purchased my first wooden duck boat, which I believe to be a Devlin Black Brant II build. Unfortunately, it looks like the odds of me tracking down the original owner are pretty low, but it looks like it was probably built in the Chicago area around 1999. Even with my very limited knowledge, I recognize that there are some issues with the boat that I'm going to have to address. It was cheap enough that even if a repair/restoration doesn't work out, I think the practice and experience will probably make it a worthwhile adventure. I'm really hoping to get lots of advice before I start the repairs. I've purchased the BB II plans from Devlin, and just started reading his book. Other than what I've learned from this forum and any youtube video I can find, I am as green as they come to constructing and repairing wooden/fiberglass boats. I thought I would start out with some overall pictures of the boat, starting with how it looked when I picked it up, and after I got the blind removed and cleaned up a bit. I'll follow this post up with a summary of some of the problem areas I've identified and some requests for how to deal with them.
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The first issue that I've noticed is the hull. The outside looks pretty darn good, but the inside has a few problem areas. It doesn't appear that it was ever painted. There was a removable plywood floorboard that had two 2x8 supports. The braces weren't shaped to the hull of the boat or rounded in any way, so I think most of the weight in the boat was concentrated where they made contact unfortunately. It looks like some of those places have worn down the epoxy to the plywood. There are also some spots that I don't think were covered by the floor that the epoxy is missing/peeling, not really sure why maybe UV because it was never painted, or just wear and tear from use. Pics below of the interior hull problem areas. You can also see some of the damaged areas in the pictures I included in the first post. For this repair, I'm thinking I just need to really clean the surface, sand down the damaged areas, and apply a few layers of epoxy?

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The second problem area are the keelsons. The metal runners are in pretty bad shape or missing in some areas, and there are some areas where the fillets along the side look pretty bad. My first though was just that I should probably take off the metal runners, do some clean up and assessment and hopefully just epoxy repair and replace the runners. However, I've noticed screws from at least the two side keelsons that go up into the hull and were then ground down. I'm thinking these are the screws used to install the runners but I'm not certain. I don't see any sign of water coming in at these screws, but that does concern me, and I'm sure what my best path forward would be from here. Thoughts?
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The third and most obvious, and maybe (?) most serious issue on the boat is the state of the fiberglass on the sheer clamp, and possibly the condition of the sheer clam as well. For a good portion of the boat, the fiberglass is peeling up from the sheer clamp. The front doesn't look to bad, but the stern is pretty much completely separated. I've pulled some off to take a look at the wood, and for the most part I think it looks ok. There is one area of wood that does not look good on the right side near the rear of the boat, and the back left corner could look a little better. Maybe the biggest concern to me is that the clamp seems to be pulling away from the hull a little bit on the right side of the stern flotation pod (the area I can't get to the interior easily of course). I'd welcome any and all thoughts on how to take on repairs to these issues. My thoughts were to try and remove/sand down the fiberglass from the entire sheer clamp and epoxy it and re-fiberglass it if the wood is in good enough condition.

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Richard,
Nice boat; definitely a BB2. And judging by the condition of the bottom of the boat, it's not been run hard. I've built a BB2 and Broadbill, and am in the process of wrapping up a Cackler. Love the BB2; have had it out fishing the last few weekends.

My boats have mostly been garaged, so, I've not had a whole lot of repairs to do, other than some minor work on the Broadbill. However, will offer some thoughts. Most of what I know is through the school of hard knocks.

Sounds like you are off to a good start on addressing the problem. First priority would be for finding any exposed wood and dealing with it. That includes screw holes, cracks, gouges, rub points, delamination, etc.. Exposed wood rots; sealed, dry wood is very durable. I'd also try to figure out what is going on with the floatation compartments (are they watertight, and, are they filled with foam?). There have been issues with some boats leaking water into the compartments and saturating foam. With no knowledge of the history of the boat, I would cut a hole in each compartment to check it out and install deck plates to inspect at later times, but, that is just an opinion. You can do a search on this site, and will see wet foam can be ugly.

Also, check the knees at the most interior point where they join the hull for cracks. This has been a weak spot on some boats, but may not be a problem on yours. If cracked, you can repair with bigger fillets and new fiberglass tape, or go stronger with a floor beam, other floor support structure or even bond floor the floor in place.

Anywhere hard items rub epoxied wood, there can be a problem, like your floating floor support contact points. I originally was trailering my Broadbill on plain wood bunks; the vibration and grit ate through the paint and started eating into the epoxy. I fixed that, swapped to a new carpeted trailer, and even after extensive trailering you cannot tell where the carpet supports the hull. Fixing the inside of the hull is easy; just sand and apply 3 coat of epoxy. Another option in my opinion is you could place glass over the area, just like top coating the deck. I did find some fine line cracks on the inside floor of my Broadbill after using it for several years. I sanded it and put a layer of thin glass and 3 coats epoxy. Based on that experience, I glassed the inside floors of the other 2 boats while they were being built. You might consider a flexible cloth that can be used with boat building epoxy work; I think Devlin recommends Dynel now. You need to look at other options for floors support, or, at least putting some foam strip at the contact points. The floor in my BB2 is loose (I like to be able to see what is going on under it). However, I ran foam weather-strip along the contact points to avoid damaging the epoxy and exposing wood.

Not sure why someone put long screws through the keels, but if at all suspect I'd take them out and fill with epoxy/wood flour. If the keels are properly epoxied in place, the screws are of no value.

As for the runners on top the keelsons, just replace with like (looks like you have 1/8" aluminum, which works very well). Bed with 5200 and use 1/2"ss screws per Devlin's plans to hold in place. There are other options on keels if you do a complete rework, but what you have works well.

For the rub rails, I am hoping someone who has done restoration chimes in. I have only see fiberglass peel off like that on the maple I used for the oarlocks on my Broadbill. My plan is to replace them with Doug Fir, which seems to absorb enough epoxy to prevent any delaminating. Using the right wood seems to be the key for building a durable epoxy encapsulated wooden boat.

You can sand and fill with fairing compound to take the fiberglass texture out of the boat, if desired. Just keep in mind removing material is removing strength and moisture barrier, so you cannot sand too much or you will need to add more fiberglass/epoxy.

Oh, and since you have a BB2, you may want to put on your motor, then move the it from the down position to the full up, while turned completely left or right. If the anti ventilation plate hits the sponsons, you may want cut the lower inside corners of the sponson to make clearance so as not to damage your engine it kick up. There have been several posts recently of BB2/BB3's that have had this modification done.

Have fun with the boat- looks like you got a good one!

-Bill
 
Good morning, Richard~

Looks like you've got a fine vessel that needs some typical TLC. And, you've already got a great deal of excellent advice and information from Bill.

A few more thoughts - from one who has never built, owned or restored any Devlin boat - have have had scores of duckboats through my shop:

1) It looks like you have no serious rot - a critical issue in any epoxy-encapsulated boat. I see some discoloration of of your rubrails (gunwales, sheer strakes) - is that just mildew or is it at all soft? If the latter, it should be dug out and then re-sealed and filled.

2) Some of the photos show a lack of "finish", e,g., ragged edges of 'glass that had never been filled and faired. I encourage you to strive for a show-quality finish in all of your work. It is not a matter of mere aesthetics. Fair and smooth surfaces will better withstand the rigors of sun and sea.

3) Regarding your rubrails - and other edges above the waterline: I would encourage you to "ease" all of the edges so that the 'glass does not have to make a hard 90-degree bend. I would use a round-over bit in a router - a 3/8" radius would be a good choice - and soften such edges before re-sealing and 'glassing. The router will not work well in some areas - like the lower edge of the rubrails. I would round these by hand, with plane, rasp, Surform, sanding block.

I would also fillet the lower seam where the rubrail meets the hull. Finally, I would apply new 'glass from the deck over the entire rubrail and then down onto the hull. As Devlin explains in his book, you do not need factory tape for this. Make your own by cutting cloth on a diagonal (bias). In this area, I would be tempted to apply 2 layers of 6 ounce cloth for the added durability.

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One other thought. I appreciate all of your detailed photos. It would be helpful to those of us commenting if you could identify each - even with just a number or letter. I have found, too, that if you add any text between photos, they become properly oriented.

I look forward to your continued progress and hope my thoughts are helpful.

All the best,

SJS
 
The advice so far is much appreciated, keep it coming!

I had some time today to get started. I got a fair of chunk of the fiberglass stripped off the sheer clamp. The good news is that most of the wood looks really good. It looks like the builder ran the glass from the deck down over the rail and I think cut it off right at the bottom corner of the rail. It doesn't look like it continues to the bottom surface of the rail or further down to the hull. The rail is also not angled on the bottom surface like it is in the boat plans, so both the top and bottom have 90 degree corners. I attempted to capture it in the picture below. It is hard to tell, but this picture is looking up from below, the top of the picture is the rail where I've removed the fiberglass.
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It looks like there is an extra layer of glass tape on the top edge of the rail, which is making removal harder.
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In the picture below you can see the progress I made peeling off the fiberglass on one side with a scraper in few hours. I think from here it will take some sanding. Any input on what I need to do around the edges of the deck where the new fiberglass will overlap? Sand off the paint and down to the glass but try and leave the fiberglass intact? Steve I really like your idea of rounding the edges and will probably go that route for the top and bottom edges of the clamp.
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There is one bad areas of about 4 or 5 inches that I may have fix. You can see in in the picture below just to the left of the strap.

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The bad news is the keelsons don't look like they are going to be a easy fix. The screws were indeed run up into the hull and then ground off. I got one or two to come out, but there are already a few with broken off heads, and one broke on me with pretty minimal pressure.
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I think the keels are also attached like the devlin plans call for, but I'm not certain. I'm not sure what to do with these. The aluminum rails will need replaced for sure, so maybe remove the screws, try and fill the holes, strip and redo the fillet and replace the aluminum and call it good? I assume removing them from the hull is a pretty difficult process if they are attached correctly?
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Good morning, Richard~


Progress looks good. For removing existing 'glass, you may try heat. An electric heat gun or a Bernzomatic torch (my preference) will soften the 'glass and allow it to be removed with a putty knife and/or scraper. This is an outside job - and you may want breathing protection as well.


You've described the process of fairing new 'glass onto existing. Here is where an orbital sander - with 60-grit - can give you the control you need so you don't remove too much 'glass.


All the best,


SJS





 
Richard~


Regarding the "keelsons" - which I would call strakes - or maybe runners or rubbing strips.



(NOTE: I am notoriously an unreformed, Old School fussbudget regarding terminology. Keelsons - like sheer clamps - are longitudinal framing members on the interior of the hull. I gather Sam Devlin or other builders have used these terms in a more novel way....)



In any event, it looks like they may need to be re-attached. In your second photo it looks like a gap between the strake and the hull that should be filled - presumably with thickened epoxy. If it also needs to be pulled back onto the hull during the gluing process, you can clamp it with:


1) a strong ratchet strap around the entire hull. Where the strap passes over the strake I would insert a wooden wedge. Once you have the strap good and tight, tap the wedge in further until you get the pressure you need. (You could also use a chain for this process.)



or



2) temporarily drill through the strake and hull (if you have easy access to this area in the interior) and clamp it with a bolt and a fender washer.. Once the epoxy cures fully, you can remove the bolt and then fill the hole with more thickened epoxy.


Otherwise, your approach of removing existing fasteners, filling holes, filleting and fairing are all right on the money - in my view. After the strakes are fully rehabbed, the aluminum rubbing strips (or shoes) should be bedded in 3M 5200 (as Bill has suggested) or the like and fastened with maybe 3/4-inch flathead s/s screws that go into the strake only - not up into the hull.


All the best,



SJS

 
it's been a while since I built my bbII and if I recall correctly, I had added the keelsons or strakes with top pressure and epoxy (no fasteners) to avoid piercing the hull. I ran into a fellow that was facing the same question you are and he took the existing keelsons off with a belt sander and to his word, it was not an overly painful process. If you are digging into this boat, I can't recommend enough a sander grinder with an 8" soft pad. It was my go to tool while building the boat and fairing glass and I have been surprised at just how much exercise it's gotten on other projects since the build. Mine was a used ebay purchase and still going gangbusters 20 years later.
 
Jamus,
Good to see you on here.
I'd forgotten to mention the grinder. My "go to" tool for correcting stubborn wood/epoxy that needs neatened up is a 7" Harbor Freight variable speed buffer. With a 7" plastic backing and anywhere between 34- 60 grit fiber disk you can really work down bumps.

Richard,
You might consider a harbor freight one. They are relatively inexpensive, and mine has held up through 2 builds with now sign of failing. The variable speed offers nice control, and I usually run on low settings as it really moves material. It does require a little finess and you have to pay attention with the larger grit.

Also, if you have not done so, check out Eric's building Devlin's Scaup links off the main page of Duckboats. He shows how he did the aluminum strips on the keels, to include countersinking the holes so the screw heads don't drag or catch.

v/r
Bill
 
I've been able to make a bit more progress while waiting for some tools and equipment to arrive. I've gotten the rubrail fiberglass removed from the entire boat, and I'm about to start cleaning the edge of the top deck. I had one area of the rail that had bad wood. I dug it out, and it went all the way down to the hull. The hull looks good behind it, so I'm tempted to fill this in with epoxy/filler. I still have a bit more digging to do to make sure all the bad wood is removed. I am planning to open up both flotation areas as suggested and check and make sure everything looks good from the inside. I haven't really worked out where the water was coming from, but this area is right behind where previous owners have been running a strap over the boat while trailering (like in the picture below), so I suspect that may have played a role in the damage. This is a good reminder that I need to work out a better system to secure the boat to the trailer.
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I am struggling to decide how to handle the strakes/keelsons. I've been able to remove the aluminum runners from both of the shorter side strakes. The screws the builder used did in fact go up through the hull like I suspected. Removal of the screws that were still intact went relatively well, but about half of the screws were already broken off and one or two broke as soon as I put any pressure on them. These broken off screws are on my mind. I was hoping to fill the screw holes with epoxy filler, re-fillet the strakes, add new aluminum and be done. The attachment of the strakes to the hull seems to be solid, and for the most part they seem to be in fair condition. My question to the group is how much should I be worried about leaving those broken off screws in there? Is an epoxy filler in/over the holes a sufficient solution? Jamus' suggestion regarding sanding off the strakes and replacing them seems like the best option to resolve this if the screws are a problem, but I have to admit I'm not super excited to try and sand them off without damaging the hull and replacing everything.
 
Good morning, Richard~


I see no need to remove the broken off - or impossible to remove - screws from the strakes.


If you want to, you could try to "excavate" around each screw with a plug cutter. Then try to extract with a needle-nosed vise-grips.


Otherwise, fill-fair-forget!


SJS

 
I've made a bit of progress on cleaning up the sheer clamp/rail in preparation for new glass while waiting for all the parts of my new sander/polisher to arrive. After a night of sanding with my orbital sander, I'm already looking forward to being able to use that bigger, more powerful tool on the flat surfaces. It is slow going but it feels good to be able to see at least some progress.
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I also ordered my fiberglass, epoxy and associated supplies yesterday. I was initially planning on West, but after seeing the prices and reading plenty of good reviews on this site, I ended up going with US Composites. I'm hoping to be ready for some initial epoxy work by the time my order arrives.
 
Progress has been slow but steady. I finally finished getting the edge of the deck, the rail, and the upper hull sanded off and ready for the new fiberglass.
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I know I've got a long way to go, but I was ready for a bit of a break from the constant sanding. I'm still waiting on the sanding pad for my polisher/sander to come in, so I've been working with my orbital sander only so far. Temps have gotten into the upper 90's in Kansas this week, so work in the garage in the evening has been more of a weight loss program than anything. I gave all the exposed surfaces a good wipe down with water to clean them up, and got ready for the next step.

Today was a pretty exciting day, I mixed my first batch of epoxy. It was too hot to be doing it really, but I wanted to make some progress and I've been looking at the box supplies for a few days now so I was ready. The rate the thickened epoxy hardened made for some quick work. I went with US composites medium hardener, and in summer temps that is probably not the best option.

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I needed to fill holes in the rail and deck. I figured that was pretty hard to screw up too bad for my first try with epoxy. I started out by taping the bottom of any holes that I could get to in the cockpit, then did what I could to get them soaked with non-thickened epoxy. I tried using a syringe, but the ones I ordered were too big for the job really, maybe something more needle size would have worked better. I used a squeegee to do my best to get at least some epoxy in the holes and clean off the mess and called it good.

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I then mixed what was left of that epoxy with US Composites fairing compound, and went back around and tried to pack the holes full with a squeegee. I started out using the material pretty sparingly and trying to scrape it pretty clean, but at some point I decided a better option was to be a little more liberal with how much I was using and how much I left on there, assuming I should be able to come back and sand it off pretty easily. Maybe I will regret that later. It doesn't look clean but I think it worked pretty well.


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The first batch got hard on me before I could finish up by filling the one area of bad wood that I have removed from the rail, so I mixed up another batch to give that area a go. I gave it a thorough soaking of un-thickened epoxy, and then did the same mix to fill it in. It was a big enough area that I went ahead and covered it with packing tape when I was done. The picture below isn't the best, but shows the area on the rail. I just pulled off the tape this evening and it looks pretty good. I put enough on there that there is room to sand it down to level, which is what I was shooting for.

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So progress is continuing. I hope to be able to epoxy and fiberglass the rails sometime in the next week or two. Then it is time to flip the boat and start on the bottom issues. I did take the chance to get the pup in the boat for the first time today. He seemed as eager as I am to get this thing out on the water.

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I still had a little bit of filling to do before everything was smooth and flat and ready for fiberglass, so went ahead with that this week. Probably applied more than I needed to, but I learned this weekend it is easy enough to sand it down to where it needs to be. A night or two of sanding and I think I'll be ready for fiberglass.

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It was a cool enough day and I had the time so I also went ahead and put a layer of epoxy on the areas on the inside of the hull that had wood exposed. The darkest areas in this picture are what was bare wood. Any reason for concern that it turned so dark like that? I think I will go ahead and coat the entire interior with expoxy and paint at some point, but I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the same fairing compound to level off those areas where it was down to bare wood?


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My 6" beckson deck plates for the sponson access arrived today. Thank you Steve Sanford for the recommendation for those. I drilled into the sponsons a few weeks back, but could see no sign of water, mold or mildew. The spray in foam looked pretty good, at least from a 1" hole. I was originally planning to remove the spray foam and put in something removable, but if it still looks good when I cut the holes for the deck plates I may just leave it like it is for the time being.
 
Good morning, Richard~


All looks great!


I would not be concerned about the darker areas. I am guessing the wood there was more porous - but the epoxy should seep in and cure that.


re fairing the worn spots: If you can feel the difference in surface elevation with your hand, I would recommend using the fairing compound to get everything nice and level and...."fair". It looks like you are developing good technique. I would use a squeegee in tough-to-get-to spots to get it as level as possible with the first application of fairing mix. It's easier to fill any small voids or irregularities with a second application than to try to get a sander into tight spaces. And, remember that the fairing compound cures a bit more porous than straight resin (because the microballoons are cut open when sanded) so a topcoat of resin is needed before you apply paint.



Finally, it makes sense to leave the foam. in your sponsons The Beckson's allow for regular (annual?) inspection so you can monitor as needed.


All the best,


SJS






 
You are doing a great job, the project is coming along nicely! You'll love it when it's done. I much prefer my bluebill to my big lund when it comes to hunting ducks. I'd love to sell the lund and build an 18-20' stitch and glue boat, but I doubt the costs would even come close, and I don't have the time to spend at this period of life.

Mr. Sanford, will you PLEASE write a book for all of us to read? It could be about anything, really. Preferably duck hunting and boats and whatnot.
 
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