How much would you spend?

P

Paul Mc

Active member
The mechanic just called with his estimate on my 1989 Johnson 15. It was a freshwater engine with low hours but a few seasons of saltwater duck hunting does what it does.
The throttle cable, kill switch, field pump, water pump and carb kit with labor takes it over the $1,000 mark.
On one side of the coin, that's a lot of money. On the other, it's a rebuild that comes out a lot cheaper than a new, much heavier engine.
Your thoughts?
 
Wow, that's a lot of repairs.
Most of this you can easily do yourself (if you have time).
Only one I wouldn't care to tackle is the carb rebuild.
Fix it up, don't use ethanol gas and you have an engine that can last another 20 years.
How's the sacrificial anode look?
 
I'll have him poke around everything else, but it ran great before I didn't winterize it and let it sit for 5 years like a dummy. I've done most of those repairs before, but just don't have the time any more. Thanks for your input.
 
I don't want to hijack my own thread, but since you mentioned that Carl; I do intend to put this engine into climate controlled storage once repaired. Is here a "good way" to let an engine sit knowingly for a period of time?
 
Avoid Seasense impellers, they deteriorate VERY quickly. Starbrite makes a gasoline additive that prolongs fuel longevity and also serves as a fogging agent, essentially distributing this subcomponent thoroughly throughout the fuel supply line, as well as inside the cylinder and over the piston(s). Starts up a little easier in the spring without the massive fogging solution cloud as well. Less than half the smoke. I have used it on a Verado 250, a Yamaha Saltwater series 225hp, my Honda 50hp and the twin Yamaha Saltwater Series 150hp motors on my center console.
 
Paul, I am not sure if there is a really "good" way to let engines sit for a long period of time but with my chipper shredder and my generator and gas powered weed whacker, I make sure to turn the fuel line off and let it run til it dies of no more fuel. the weed whacker I usually use a tank at a time. The weed whacker I have had for 6 years now and use it two or three times a year (I put a metal blade on it for cutting the ditch and along my woods when it gets too close to the fence line) and I have not had any issues with starting it up or it running well when I make sure to run it dry.

Not sure if that is the best way to go about it, but it has worked for me well and all of those engines start up pretty easily when I need them to.
 
This just in, he was able to get it running right at first attempt only to find all the problems I listed in prior email. He said compression was good. He's working up a new estimate with some after market parts to drop the cost a bit.
 
If you decide to store it for any period of time run out all fuel in fresh water location and fog then dump what ever fuel left in sediment bowl and clean if so equiped. If not that little bit of fuel will either varnish or if still liquid next time you start it it will be first thing into carb starting new carb issues. Impellers can still take a set from long term storage and theres not much you can do about it but hope for the best.
 
I have a 2005 Johnson 15hp with the same general concept as yours. I tend to go way overboard and may be in the same situation as you soon. My way takes longer but I try to do everything the right way.

1) First and foremost, at the very least, flush the motor with fresh water if not a "Salt Away" flush kit which I believe every duck hunter should have for their rig.
2) Run the motor with a high quality 93 octane fuel mixed with good quality 2 stroke oil from a gas station that has a high turnover (busy highway gas stations, higher turnover, better gas)
3) Be sure that above fuel has a healthy dose of Stabil-Marine and a ring-free (Yamaha and Startron are good brands)
4) In the process of running, fog the motor properly with a good spray. You might also consider de-carbing the motor as well with the right spray but do this BEFORE fogging.
5) Run the carb out of fuel (only do this for long term storage as starving the cylinders can cause small wear each time)
6) Remove the spark plugs and give a quick shot of fogger into each cylinder. Replace with new plugs as decarbing and fogging while running will likely have killed your plugs in there (this is normal). Put some dielectric grease on the plug tops before you put the boots back on.
7) Once you're done running your motor, do the following:

a) Remove #15 and #16 in this diagram of your carb. This will drain the float bowl. This is so important. Many guys run their OB dry and think that's it. Nope. Bowl still has fuel in it. Put the screw and gasket back on once fuel stops dripping. You can put paper towels around the carb to absorb the fuel.

Diagram
https://www.boats.net/catalog/johnson/outboard-by-year/1989/j15ecec/carburetor

b) Disconnect your lines from the fuel pump and let that drain as well.
c) Press the pin on your fuel connector to drain any and all fuel out of the lines.
d) Put your fuel pump hoses back on.

8) Drain your lower unit oil and put new in, with new plug gaskets.
9) Take your prop off, clean the shaft, and put new grease on. Re-install. I can't tell you how many guys neglect this and down the line find themselves cutting their prop off because it froze to the shaft. Mine gets removed, regreased, and set with a new pin, every year.
10) Grease all your grease points on the main pivot shaft and all tilt trim.

Now many of you will probably ask, why not replace the water pump? Well, it's probably going to get brittle and rot during storage. You'll need to make a note to yourself to replace it with a new kit when it comes out of storage and put back to use. With all that being said, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to just replace the water pump and get off to the races when the motor is recommissioned.

This is going to be my procedure in the foreseeable future. I am upgrading to a 25hp on my Duck Invader but would like to keep the Johnson 15hp for a sneakbox and/or my kids boat down the line.
 
Jay K said:
I have a 2005 Johnson 15hp with the same general concept as yours. I tend to go way overboard and may be in the same situation as you soon. My way takes longer but I try to do everything the right way.

1) First and foremost, at the very least, flush the motor with fresh water if not a "Salt Away" flush kit which I believe every duck hunter should have for their rig.
2) Run the motor with a high quality 93 octane fuel mixed with good quality 2 stroke oil from a gas station that has a high turnover (busy highway gas stations, higher turnover, better gas)
3) Be sure that above fuel has a healthy dose of Stabil-Marine and a ring-free (Yamaha and Startron are good brands)
4) In the process of running, fog the motor properly with a good spray. You might also consider de-carbing the motor as well with the right spray but do this BEFORE fogging.
5) Run the carb out of fuel (only do this for long term storage as starving the cylinders can cause small wear each time)
6) Remove the spark plugs and give a quick shot of fogger into each cylinder. Replace with new plugs as decarbing and fogging while running will likely have killed your plugs in there (this is normal). Put some dielectric grease on the plug tops before you put the boots back on.
7) Once you're done running your motor, do the following:

a) Remove #15 and #16 in this diagram of your carb. This will drain the float bowl. This is so important. Many guys run their OB dry and think that's it. Nope. Bowl still has fuel in it. Put the screw and gasket back on once fuel stops dripping. You can put paper towels around the carb to absorb the fuel.

Diagram
https://www.boats.net/catalog/johnson/outboard-by-year/1989/j15ecec/carburetor

b) Disconnect your lines from the fuel pump and let that drain as well.
c) Press the pin on your fuel connector to drain any and all fuel out of the lines.
d) Put your fuel pump hoses back on.

8) Drain your lower unit oil and put new in, with new plug gaskets.
9) Take your prop off, clean the shaft, and put new grease on. Re-install. I can't tell you how many guys neglect this and down the line find themselves cutting their prop off because it froze to the shaft. Mine gets removed, regreased, and set with a new pin, every year.
10) Grease all your grease points on the main pivot shaft and all tilt trim.

Now many of you will probably ask, why not replace the water pump? Well, it's probably going to get brittle and rot during storage. You'll need to make a note to yourself to replace it with a new kit when it comes out of storage and put back to use. With all that being said, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to just replace the water pump and get off to the races when the motor is recommissioned.

This is going to be my procedure in the foreseeable future. I am upgrading to a 25hp on my Duck Invader but would like to keep the Johnson 15hp for a sneakbox and/or my kids boat down the line.
Click to expand...

Can you come over? Pfffft.....wow, I'm going to print this out.
 
Oh and also, do not EVER use an aftermarket water pump kit in those motors. 50% are garbage, 50% are decent but not even close to OEM. I had an aftermarket one lying around for mine. I put it in this season. Low and behold, I had trouble getting prime at the ramp somedays. It would take some generous revving of the motor to get it to "pee" out the tell-tale. Put an OEM one in, primed itself within 2-3 seconds every start.
 
Paul Mc said:
Jay K said:
I have a 2005 Johnson 15hp with the same general concept as yours. I tend to go way overboard and may be in the same situation as you soon. My way takes longer but I try to do everything the right way.

1) First and foremost, at the very least, flush the motor with fresh water if not a "Salt Away" flush kit which I believe every duck hunter should have for their rig.
2) Run the motor with a high quality 93 octane fuel mixed with good quality 2 stroke oil from a gas station that has a high turnover (busy highway gas stations, higher turnover, better gas)
3) Be sure that above fuel has a healthy dose of Stabil-Marine and a ring-free (Yamaha and Startron are good brands)
4) In the process of running, fog the motor properly with a good spray. You might also consider de-carbing the motor as well with the right spray but do this BEFORE fogging.
5) Run the carb out of fuel (only do this for long term storage as starving the cylinders can cause small wear each time)
6) Remove the spark plugs and give a quick shot of fogger into each cylinder. Replace with new plugs as decarbing and fogging while running will likely have killed your plugs in there (this is normal). Put some dielectric grease on the plug tops before you put the boots back on.
7) Once you're done running your motor, do the following:

a) Remove #15 and #16 in this diagram of your carb. This will drain the float bowl. This is so important. Many guys run their OB dry and think that's it. Nope. Bowl still has fuel in it. Put the screw and gasket back on once fuel stops dripping. You can put paper towels around the carb to absorb the fuel.

Diagram
https://www.boats.net/catalog/johnson/outboard-by-year/1989/j15ecec/carburetor

b) Disconnect your lines from the fuel pump and let that drain as well.
c) Press the pin on your fuel connector to drain any and all fuel out of the lines.
d) Put your fuel pump hoses back on.

8) Drain your lower unit oil and put new in, with new plug gaskets.
9) Take your prop off, clean the shaft, and put new grease on. Re-install. I can't tell you how many guys neglect this and down the line find themselves cutting their prop off because it froze to the shaft. Mine gets removed, regreased, and set with a new pin, every year.
10) Grease all your grease points on the main pivot shaft and all tilt trim.

Now many of you will probably ask, why not replace the water pump? Well, it's probably going to get brittle and rot during storage. You'll need to make a note to yourself to replace it with a new kit when it comes out of storage and put back to use. With all that being said, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to just replace the water pump and get off to the races when the motor is recommissioned.

This is going to be my procedure in the foreseeable future. I am upgrading to a 25hp on my Duck Invader but would like to keep the Johnson 15hp for a sneakbox and/or my kids boat down the line.
Click to expand...

Can you come over? Pfffft.....wow, I'm going to print this out.
Click to expand...

My labor charge is $200/hour. Marine diesel mechanic rates haha. I'm semi kidding, I do all the work on our twin CAT 575hp diesels in our sportfish as well. My wife tells me I might have OCD. I just really find gratification seeing things work perfectly and having a project go as planned.
 
So it boils down to $930 for:


New Kill switch (likely the cause of some spark issues)
New Throttle Cable and control
New fuel pump
New water pump
Combustion is good
lower unit and gear oil changed
New plugs
New zink
New pull cord
General inspection and tank tested
Winterized

[font=Lucida Grande, Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Turns out the Merc kill switch is 1/2 the price of OMC and a few other changes in parts got the price down. The alternative is a Mere 9.9 that would be an additional $1300 and it's less power and 30lbs heavier......(nope)....[/font]
 
Paul Mc said:
So it boils down to $930 for:
I would also have him change the thermostat. That part cost about 50 dollars. Or at least take the cover off and clean out the salt.


New Kill switch (likely the cause of some spark issues)
New Throttle Cable and control
New fuel pump
New water pump
Combustion is good
lower unit and gear oil changed
New plugs
New zink
New pull cord
General inspection and tank tested
Winterized

[font=Lucida Grande, Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Turns out the Merc kill switch is 1/2 the price of OMC and a few other changes in parts got the price down. The alternative is a Mere 9.9 that would be an additional $1300 and it's less power and 30lbs heavier......(nope)....[/font]
Click to expand...
 
Paul Mc said:
The mechanic just called with his estimate on my 1989 Johnson 15. It was a freshwater engine with low hours but a few seasons of saltwater duck hunting does what it does.
The throttle cable, kill switch, field pump, water pump and carb kit with labor takes it over the $1,000 mark.
On one side of the coin, that's a lot of money. On the other, it's a rebuild that comes out a lot cheaper than a new, much heavier engine.
Your thoughts?
Click to expand...

I just did everything on your list to my 1983 Evinrude 9.9. except the throttle cable and carb rebuild. Plus I replaced the recoil starter spring, rope and handle along with fuel lines and spark plugs. I didn't need a throttle cable. The bill for the carb rebuild was $200 including a $45 carb kit. Total into the repairs came to a little over $350. The repairs are pretty simple to do yourself with a little help from YouTube. As mentioned I suggest buying from a marine website like Crowley.com or Marineengine.com. I learned my lesson about buying marine parts from Amazon.
 
Being in the petroleum industry and seeing what ethanol does to equipment that tends to sometimes sit for periods of time. Stay away from ethanol added gas and I know it hurts to sometimes spend 1.50 more a gallon but piece of mind and the effects of ethanol have on our smaller engines is nothing compared to down the line costs. I ran into this website years ago and I hope this helps with finding places where you can buy gasoline with no ethanol. I have nothing to do with this website but I know it helps.. For that matter some of the marinas will let you fill a remote tank at their fuel dock if you just ask and walk up with a true gas container.
https://www.pure-gas.org/ ... Don't know why it does not highlight for the link but just copy and paste. Has most of the locations that sell true gasoline with no ethanol in the US and Canada. Thanks Mark just my two cents:)
 
I should add like others have said, sometimes it pays to do yourself. I would consider myself mechanically inclined as I've been wrenching on things since 10 years old. Youtube and service manuals are your friend. Earlier this season I did a completely light-overhaul of my 15hp.

- New plugs
- Carb clean and rebuild
- New fuel pump
- New water pump
- New t-stat
- Lower unit oil
- Put a new prop on

I think it cost me maybe $175 in parts to do.

The only real territory where you may want to enlist the help of a professional shop is when you get into lower unit rebuilds and resealing, and pulling the powerhead. Even those can be walked through step by step in a good service manual.

On the other hand, time is money for some people. I get that.
 
Thanks for the Intel Ed. I plan to store the engine until at least next duck season to take my boys out for their maiden (boat) duck season and I just want to know that it's professionally "gone over" and winterized properly. I've rebuilt carbs and installed impellers etc. but I'm really just too busy to get into that this time.
Gas question, is the higher the octane, the less Ethanol? Or do the highest octane gasses have no ethanol? I'd like to get gas out of this equation. Is regular gas plus additives = high octane gas with no ethanol?
 
Markus T. Ernst said:
Being in the petroleum industry and seeing what ethanol does to equipment that tends to sometimes sit for periods of time. Stay away from ethanol added gas and I know it hurts to sometimes spend 1.50 more a gallon but piece of mind and the effects of ethanol have on our smaller engines is nothing compared to down the line costs. I ran into this website years ago and I hope this helps with finding places where you can buy gasoline with no ethanol. I have nothing to do with this website but I know it helps.. For that matter some of the marinas will let you fill a remote tank at their fuel dock if you just ask and walk up with a true gas container.
https://www.pure-gas.org/ ... Don't know why it does not highlight for the link but just copy and paste. Has most of the locations that sell true gasoline with no ethanol in the US and Canada. Thanks Mark just my two cents:)
Click to expand...

Just as I suspected, one location that isn't 2+ hours from me here in NJ. It's a shame. It became apparent to me how bad the gas here actually is when I had to clean a carb on a brand new snowblower after sitting over the summer. I just have a gas rotation at the house now. The end of this season, I'll take my 50:1 reserves and siphon them into my truck 2-3 gallons at a time. The truck tank is 33 gallons so it won't make much of a difference. I do the same with the generator reserves every 6-7 months.

One thing I will say, for 4-stroke equipment (even outboards) you folks should consider storing it with "Tru-Fuel" in the carbs. Every time I run my snowblower and generator down, I'll dump a small amount of the tin can "Tru-Fuel" in and let them run for a few minutes. The tin can fuel is no ethanol and stabilizes for at least a year. Don't do this with 2 stroke equipment for obvious reasons. For my 2-stroke lawn equipment, I use nothing but tin can 2 stroke fuel.
 
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