Canada triggers pause on Migratory Bird Regs in US
- Thread starter Kim Ross
- Start date
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Thanks, Kim - good news!
All the best,
SJS
All the best,
SJS
By regs, they mean accidentally killing birds during otherwise lawful activities not hunting regulations. Canada and US cooperate well on hunting regulations and for many years on the interpretation of the treaty in regards to accidental or incidental killing of birds. The last Administration wanted to change that long history. They proposed to change it and almost completed the process before they left office in January. The comment period that is mentioned in the article is asking if we should go back to the interpretation that has stood for the 50 previous years. The vast majority of public comments during the rule making over the last two years were opposed to removing the prohibition on incidental killing of birds. If anyone has questions I?d be happy to try to answer them or explain the situation.
Does this mean the windfarms are fined? Hard to believe that would happen with the push to move away from fossil fuels. I've read where the big farms kill many birds, sometimes thousands during night migration. The only such damage I've seen personally is at a small private one that killed several dozen swallows a couple years ago. I would guess it happened during the day, apparently the birds misjudge the speed of the blade.
Ultimately there needs to be a workable system that authorizes some limited residual killing after an industry does what it can to eliminate/reduce the bird deaths. Just ignoring it is a recipe for more endangered species listings or functional extinction. That would be a disaster. Renewable energy sources cause incidental bird deaths just like oil and gas and electric transmission lines and many other industries. But best management practices that reduces or eliminates bird deaths are possible and when coupled with a mitigation program that invests in conservation then we could have sustainable bird populations and industry. We need to find the win:win solution. We know conservation works. Look at waterfowl populations, the investment in wetlands conservation has maintained populations that otherwise would have declined much more. Besides maintaining birds, this would provide habitat and maintain open spaces.
I've used several multi-year studies that looked at bird movement patterns along the shoreline of the Great Lakes as aids in locating wind turbine sites to minimize bird strikes. Since these involver over-flight transects throughout the year, they are a good reference for seasonal peaks in diver and puddle duck migrations.
Last edited:
Rick you provided two good examples demonstrate what I was referring to by avoiding (locating turbines in a low bird use area) and minimizing (blade painting) incidental killing. Although the jury is still out on blade painting as far as I know.
Last edited:
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Brad et al~
Interesting info about wind turbines. In my distant past, my "sphere of influence" included DEC's unit that was concerned with wind power - both birds and bats. I had not heard of the blade painting - will have to get back in touch with some of my former colleagues. (Hurricane Covid has foreclosed my usual "catch up" lunches.) Siting location was - and I suspect always will be - a principal tool for mitigating losses. I wonder about offshore wind farms propsed for New York waters - and imagine there might be lots of as-built data from Europe.
The overall role of my old bureau was to work with the private sector to minimize impacts to fish and wildlife in practical ways; wind power was one of dozens of environmental threats - and one of the newest in my time. As you note, our role was never to play "gotcha" with industries - just to make changes to practices and equipment that could significantly lessen avoidable losses. Good government always requires a balancing act.
All the best,
SJS
Interesting info about wind turbines. In my distant past, my "sphere of influence" included DEC's unit that was concerned with wind power - both birds and bats. I had not heard of the blade painting - will have to get back in touch with some of my former colleagues. (Hurricane Covid has foreclosed my usual "catch up" lunches.) Siting location was - and I suspect always will be - a principal tool for mitigating losses. I wonder about offshore wind farms propsed for New York waters - and imagine there might be lots of as-built data from Europe.
The overall role of my old bureau was to work with the private sector to minimize impacts to fish and wildlife in practical ways; wind power was one of dozens of environmental threats - and one of the newest in my time. As you note, our role was never to play "gotcha" with industries - just to make changes to practices and equipment that could significantly lessen avoidable losses. Good government always requires a balancing act.
All the best,
SJS
Last edited:
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Good morning, Rick~
I do not want to hijack this important thread - but I thought of feral cats when I was writing my note. They have been identified as the largest source of human-induced mortality among certain birds and other wildlife. Back when I ran a task force on invasive species, neither of the 2 major NYS agencies would address the topic - too politically volatile.
It was then that I learned of the emerging practice of establishing "feral cat colonies" - where free-ranging cats are spayed or neutered then returned to live "in the wild".
Although our 2 cats are truly "indoor cats" - they only venture outdoors in my wife's arms - in the 25 years I've lived up here in dairy country, easily the most common "small mammals" I encounter in my headlights are cats. There appears to be an inexhaustible supply of "barn cats".
All the best,
SJS
I do not want to hijack this important thread - but I thought of feral cats when I was writing my note. They have been identified as the largest source of human-induced mortality among certain birds and other wildlife. Back when I ran a task force on invasive species, neither of the 2 major NYS agencies would address the topic - too politically volatile.
It was then that I learned of the emerging practice of establishing "feral cat colonies" - where free-ranging cats are spayed or neutered then returned to live "in the wild".
Although our 2 cats are truly "indoor cats" - they only venture outdoors in my wife's arms - in the 25 years I've lived up here in dairy country, easily the most common "small mammals" I encounter in my headlights are cats. There appears to be an inexhaustible supply of "barn cats".
All the best,
SJS
Vince Pagliaroli
Well-known member
Not long after I moved to NY. I became aware of the disturbing amount of cats killing songbirds, rabbits, squirrels, etc.
No matter where I go, in town, or in the outdoors hunting & fishing, cats are everywhere doing what they do.
So I called our local " Animal Control Officer". Stated the case of what was happening in our back yard due to cat carnage.
She sniffed and said, "I can't touch cats no matter if they are feral, or pets. Not on private, or public property, ever."
Why not? "That's the way it is."
Exactly what animals do you control? "Dogs".
Just dogs? "Yes only dogs."
When I see coyote, and Bobcat tracks in the snow of our yard. I SMILE. [
]As for the wind turbines. They are all over the place here, more and more being constructed to "save the planet".
Each year there are less and less songbirds, bats, waterfowl, butterflies, etc., and the blowhards in private and public positions keep the turbines turning.
Ah, compromise...
Where is Rachel Carson when we need her?
my 2 cents
When I see coyote, and Bobcat tracks in the snow of our yard. I SMILE. [
Yup, time was cats lurked under every bird feeder. When the coyotes showed up here around 1990 there were no more feral or roaming cats to be seen. Every telephone pole had a missing kitty poster.
Saw a bobcat in the yard yesterday. He was eyeing the deer eating under the birdfeeder when we spotted him. Didn't stalk them, just watching, then turned and trotted down the driveway. Cool animal.
Steve, the thread focuses on the United States pausing their "re-interpretation" of the Migratory Bird Treaty to exclude large bird kills associated with excessive or incidentally marked mortality rates. Giventhe magnitude of feral and outdoor cat induced songbird mortality, we both agree it is egregious that it is not addressed nationally simply based on the magnitude of the estimated mortality, particularly when it is ranked against all industrial activity sourced bird mortalities including wind turbines. I frequently see this completely glossed-over as a contributing mortality source, that not only is not addressed in any way to curb nationally, but often not even factored-in.
I see no marked declines in cat numbers in my neighborhood, with roughly 900acres of State and County lands within less than a quarter mile replete with wolves, coyote, fisher, pine martin, weasel, etc. This past June we had a bear wander through the wooded strip that seperates our land from my neighbor's. I mentioned it to Gary a couple of days later and he seemed totally non-plused by the information, so I asked him why he was so disinterested. He told me that two days after this transit, Cheryl called him away from the kitchen table to identify something in their front yard. He said it was immediately evident what he was looking at, particulary after watching it wander through their front yard and cut west between their house and Anderson's through the wooded strips the surround most of our lots; a cougar verified by two other more distant neighbors later.
We still have cats wandering around at night...
A wind turbine farm sited for Detour Village area on the east end of the Upper Peninsula of Michigan was "killed"due to evidence garnered from bird migration studies. What I gained from their data was the general interval when diver and puddle duck migration numbers were near peak. We used to use the data from the Whitefish Point bird observation studies, but they decided to blind them when they saw that hunters were using them to plan the vacations...
I see no marked declines in cat numbers in my neighborhood, with roughly 900acres of State and County lands within less than a quarter mile replete with wolves, coyote, fisher, pine martin, weasel, etc. This past June we had a bear wander through the wooded strip that seperates our land from my neighbor's. I mentioned it to Gary a couple of days later and he seemed totally non-plused by the information, so I asked him why he was so disinterested. He told me that two days after this transit, Cheryl called him away from the kitchen table to identify something in their front yard. He said it was immediately evident what he was looking at, particulary after watching it wander through their front yard and cut west between their house and Anderson's through the wooded strips the surround most of our lots; a cougar verified by two other more distant neighbors later.
We still have cats wandering around at night...
A wind turbine farm sited for Detour Village area on the east end of the Upper Peninsula of Michigan was "killed"due to evidence garnered from bird migration studies. What I gained from their data was the general interval when diver and puddle duck migration numbers were near peak. We used to use the data from the Whitefish Point bird observation studies, but they decided to blind them when they saw that hunters were using them to plan the vacations...
Last edited:
Steve, the science behind blade painting is still unclear. Siting the wind facilities in low risk is areas is the best way to avoid killing birds. Hopefully, new technologies will prove less deadly to birds.
The issue of cats is distinctly different than industrial incidental take. Yes, outdoor domestic and feral cats kill millions of birds. Feral Cat colonies just perpetuates the predation for years. However, the solution does not rest with a US Fish and Wildlife Service regulation or enforcement action. Local, municipal, county and state governments have jurisdiction over pets, pet policies, lands and parks of cities, counties, and states.
The issue of cats is distinctly different than industrial incidental take. Yes, outdoor domestic and feral cats kill millions of birds. Feral Cat colonies just perpetuates the predation for years. However, the solution does not rest with a US Fish and Wildlife Service regulation or enforcement action. Local, municipal, county and state governments have jurisdiction over pets, pet policies, lands and parks of cities, counties, and states.
Yes, Brad, they do, but USFWS has oversight responsibiities for migratory birds under the treaty language, a point you side-step. National issues are best addresses by national level agencies. Even a partnership with. DU or Delta via a co-sponsored public awareness campaign would be both noteworthy and worthwhile in elevating general awareness, particularly when the magnitude and duration of this trend is considered, along with the broader loss of genetic diversity among populations as they have declined.
Yes, only one study to document the benefit.
Paint it black: Efficacy of increased wind turbine rotor blade visibility to reduce avian fatalities - May - 2020 - Ecology and Evolution - Wiley Online Library
Yes, only one specific study, but these data indicate a similar effect:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ece3.6592
Migratory birds protected under the MBTA:
Birds Protected Under the Federal Migratory Bird Treaty Act (pacificwildlife.org)
Yes, only one study to document the benefit.
Paint it black: Efficacy of increased wind turbine rotor blade visibility to reduce avian fatalities - May - 2020 - Ecology and Evolution - Wiley Online Library
Yes, only one specific study, but these data indicate a similar effect:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ece3.6592
Migratory birds protected under the MBTA:
Birds Protected Under the Federal Migratory Bird Treaty Act (pacificwildlife.org)
Rick, nothing in the Treaty or Act says USFWS has authority over cats. You are right that the overall conservation of migratory birds falls to the Federal government, i didn't side step that as I am proud of spending 35 years working to ensure that birds are properly managed and conserved. You are right that cats kill millions if not billions of birds per year and they are a serious conservation problem. But the Fedeal government has no direct jurisdiction over cats except on Federal lands or potentially under other legislation such as invasive species or endangered species authorities. I was pointing out that states, counties, municipalities and cities occasionally have authority to regulate cats. The authority of the USFWS stops with identifying the threats cats cause for birds and raising concern about the impact of cats on protected species (all 1027 MBTA species) to the authorities that have jurisdiction over cats. I'd love for all cats to remain indoors and have no feral cats roaming outside and save billions of birds. Are you suggesting that USFWS has the authority to issue federal cat licenses or require owners get permission from USFWS to own cats or to let them outdoors? Or USFWS agents roaming the US eliminating feral cats or any cats they see outdoors? I don't see that ever happening.
The paper you cited is great, but it is a long way from definitively proving that blade painting reduces bird mortality except in the case of a few raptor species active during the daylight hours. I wouldn't conclude that blade painting is going to be effective for other bird groups such as night migrants or other locations. So I stand by my statement that the science on blade painting is still evolving. I hope effective mitigation measures can be developed for wind, solar and all of the other industries that cause bird mortality. That is the only to perpetuate bird populations.
The paper you cited is great, but it is a long way from definitively proving that blade painting reduces bird mortality except in the case of a few raptor species active during the daylight hours. I wouldn't conclude that blade painting is going to be effective for other bird groups such as night migrants or other locations. So I stand by my statement that the science on blade painting is still evolving. I hope effective mitigation measures can be developed for wind, solar and all of the other industries that cause bird mortality. That is the only to perpetuate bird populations.
Vince Pagliaroli
Well-known member
We are going to go into a full bore. "Save The Planet. Suck it up and deal with it, no matter the hardship", mode, and it is certainly well over do.
NO agency, city, county, state, or federal wants "The Cat Problem". To hot a topic.
Yet they sure as hell wanna make rules and regulations concerning everything else, not hot ones. Especially if they can pass em in the dead of night.
Classic case of Pass The Buck, and no way The Buck Stops Here.
NY has a law that does not allow cats to be declawed cuz it's cruel. Yet the carnage that cats cause is not cruel. WHAT - HUH?!
This is the world we live in.
Who ARE the defenders of Wildlife? Is just a dream, or a lost cause? Cuz the poop has already hit the propellers (pun or not).