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Ghenooe Bottom patch job

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Ghenooe Bottom patch job
Recently my 15' Ghenooe had started leaking quite a bit especially when under power. Yesterday things got to the point of extreme leaking so I finally crawled under once home and checked out bottom. I found several places along keel that top layer has cracked and starting to delaminate exposing a base coat of heavier mating. Other than drying out and sanding out fractured areas any other tricks to making this repair? What ounce fiberglass cloth should I use and which type of fiberglass ?
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Sounds like you haven't worn through the hull, which would require building glass back up. Rather you have a structural crack. Hard to say without seeing it but my gut instinct is 6 ounce woven fiberglass cloth on the outside and inside of the hull will stop the water. Bigger question is why did it crack and how to reinforce the root cause of the leak.

Eric
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Good morning, Roy~


I'm not familiar with your particular vessel. Is it fibreglass (and not some trickier plastic) ?


I have had to reinforce eroded keels on several of my fleet.







I always wind up reinforcing the entire length of the keel. It's a tough spot to sand/grind thoroughly. Nevertheless, I work toward applying 2 layers of 'glass - 6 or 7.5 ounce - on the outside. I may use tape or cut my own out of cloth. The first layer is about 2 inches wide and the second (top) is about 4 inches.



Before applying the cloth, I fill any holes, voids or cavities with thickened epoxy. I then begin applying the cloth whilst the filler is still uncured.



Once the 2 layers of cloth are fully cured, I fair the edge onto the hull.


NOTE: With the cured epoxy, I wash off any amine blush with water before sanding. And, the whole profile get finish-sanded with 100- or 120-grit and wiped with acetone before painting.


Hope this helps!


SJS











Steven Jay Sanford
Pencil Brook Farm
South Cambridge, NY
http://www.stevenjaysanford.com


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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
I,m thinking I probably cracked outer fiberglass mating from sliding over logs in the course of 15 years i,ve had boat. That over time has led to water seapage getting between layers of glass and starting a bit of delamination between layers. Checking yesterday I found a few portions of outer mat gone and at edges of these areas some delamination starting. Got a feeling these Ghenooes are done with a chopper gun as first layer is very coarse looking but may just be a coarser mating. Haven,t seen any areas where wear is completely thru hull but will look better once boat is flipped this weekend. Thanks for your suggestions towards repair.
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These boats are built in Florida Steve and are straight fiberglass with no structural reinforcement (wood) in keel. The keel channel is what gives strenght down center line of hull and of course rear ,mid & center seats that extend to floor and also provide flotation via cavities. Cracking probably started on outer skin from sliding over logs in areas I hunt or possably cypress knees. What type of fiberglass resin should I use for repair and thanks for the tips on glass mating.
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Roy, it may not matter now that everything is cured and dried but perhaps you should call Gheenoe and see what products they use or recommend for refurbishment. I don't know much about fixing fiberglass boats so I don't know about the effectiveness of mixing products once things dry, cure then begin having problems with wear and tear.

Maybe it isn't all that important though....hopefully I will be educated on that with future posts from folk here.

Dani
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Roy,
I bought epoxy resin and fibreglass cloth from US Composites (also located in FL) upon recommendation from Steve Sanford. Even factoring-in shipping from FL to VA their materials were far less expensive than WestMarine etc. This worked out well for some repairs/improvements I recently made on my Higbee BBSB. 'Hope this helps.

Dave
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Roy~


Got any photos?


I use the US Composites 635 Thin Resin - with Medium Hardener.


Although ll-glass boats are laminated with polyester resin, epoxy is compatible with cured 'glass and is both stronger and more waterproof. Epoxy does not like UV, however, so paint musty go on to protect it.



BTW: Epoxy resin is NOT chemically compatible with most mat (CSM = chopped strand mat).



All the best,


SJS

Steven Jay Sanford
Pencil Brook Farm
South Cambridge, NY
http://www.stevenjaysanford.com


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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Managed to get it flipped on trailer by myself. A little worse than I thought but repairable. Glad I didn,t try to run it any more hunting. Thinking along lines of running about a 6 to 8 inch layer of glass down entire center keel area to help with abrasion as there a few abrated areas along entire lenght. Here pics of worse areas and I believe larger cracked area is whats leaking. Turns out that directly below my feet when standing from rear seat. Not showing thru from inside though.
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Thanks i,ll check out U.S Composits.
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Roy,

Photos 1 and 2 where there is a crack adjacent to the keel and where the crack runs across the keel are the most concerning.

If it were mine, I would grind out beyond the crack as shown. Layer in multiple layers of chopped strand fiberglass mat. I like the chopped strand mat for repairs because the edges of each piece will blend in so well. Please note that the mat should be scored and then torn apart at the score line rather than cut all the way thru. Cutting leaves a blunt edge to the material. Scoring and tearing, separates the fibers, leaving a tapered slightly irregular edge.

cross section view of repair area


Take care, Huntindave McCann Smile SHELL ROCK IA. ,,,,,, "As sailors grow older, the wiser ones move to smaller boats." Thomas Firth Jones, Multihull Voyaging
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Do you mean grinding entirely thru hull or just flaring out crack good with a a good v extending outwards slightly?
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
roy brewington wrote:
Do you mean grinding entirely thru hull or just flaring out crack good with a a good v extending outwards slightly?


Follow the crack, if the crack goes all the way thru, (I presume it does) then yes, coming in from both sides if possible. Nothing is gained by leaving damaged materiel within the repair.

One can grind halfway or so from one side, do the repair on that side. Then flip over and repeat on the remaining side. Grinding down to expose the repair material from the first side.

Take care, Huntindave McCann Smile SHELL ROCK IA. ,,,,,, "As sailors grow older, the wiser ones move to smaller boats." Thomas Firth Jones, Multihull Voyaging
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Thanks for the advice.
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
I haven,t done any fiberglass work in about 12 years but knew I still had some materials left over from last time around. Digging way back in cabinet I found plenty of chopped strand mating and 6 oz. cloth . Unforunately the partial can of Polyester Resin I don,t trust so i,ll pick up a qt. of that & hardener and get things underway. Don,t know why these things can,t rear their head during non hunting months!
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
A product i used on the recent old town canadienne canoe was called fiberglass 1208 biaxial cloth purchased off of ebay from fiberglasssupplydepot. it is a woven cloth like roving with a layer of mat stiched to it . Great for structural repairs. I recently used it on a layout boat deck bottom joint. That is what i would use. Like Dave said , gring that crack all the way through and dish out a football shape area and back with plastic covered painters tape and fill in with increasingly larger patches. check out the pics in my old canoe post.
DHBP Member since May 1999
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Thanks for the advice Bob.
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Another fiberglass source is Raka. http://www.raka.com/

I have had good luck with their products.

Rick
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Richard Lathrop wrote:
Another fiberglass source is Raka. http://www.raka.com/

I have had good luck with their products.

Rick


+1. Have also used epoxy and glass cloth from US Composites and West System, and mixed them on boats when one or the other ran out. All seem compatible with each other. But none of my boats are chopped fiberglass, so research whether you need to stick with polyester instead of epoxy.

"At first blush I am tempted to conclude that a satisfactory hobby must be in large degree useless, inefficient, laborious, or irrelevant."
— Aldo Leopold
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
I am by no means qualified or experienced in the repair end of this but my concern looking at that first picture. That crack is that it appears to go fully across the "keel" and could represent damage due to the failure of longitudinal support (i.e., is the boats back broken?). The matting appears to be broken across the keel. If it goes all the way through the hull and across the keel, I'd be looking for way to reinforce the hull longitudinally (fore-aft) and it would be more than a patch. Are the gunwales in good shape? I am not familiar with your boat and am only responding to my impressions from that first picture.

Last edited by:

Brad Bortner: Oct 21, 2021, 1:19 PM
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Brad on these Ghenooe hulls there is no solid surface inside as in a boat keel. Think more fiberglass canoe type of construction. I intend once bottom repairs are complete to flip and build in a fiberglass pad over that area as you can see its been thru a lot of stress over the years. Thats what sliding over logs, stumps, and submerged beaver dams will do after 15 years of chasing ducks! Hard to tell from pics but that worse area is directly under where I stand when push poling over stuff.
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Re: Ghenooe Bottom patch job In reply to
Roy

Having lived in Anne Arundel, Kent, Caroline and Washington Counties I can only imagine what you've slithered across down there in Wicomico and Somerset Counties. But getting high centered crossing those logs, knees and beaver dams sounds like a good way to break the keel. Don't want to see you have to walk out of the Pocomoke bottomlands.
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If I had kept on running that boat after woodies this week that probably what would have happened. Still amazes me that the damage didn,t show from inside hull. Interior gel coat probably only thing not cracked thru. 2 weeks ago I thought it was just a leaky drain plug!
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I have a white 15'4" Gheenoe High Sider (1980's vintage) that I ran first with a 3HP Ducktwin and later with a 6.5 HP Go-Devil. I bought it used and discovered lots of bubbles and voids along the chines which I ground out and filled before painting the boat Dull Dead Grass. Otherwise it is a solid hull. Running around in our shallow, marly marsh really started wearing down the keel, especially near the stern, revealing the glass cloth just under a shallow vestige of resin. However no cracks like you have encountered. I haven't gotten around to repairing it yet because I switched to a TDB 14' that I found. Both Gheenoes and TDBs are rare in Ontario so you have to snag'em when you find'em.

There are often posts by owners on restoration and repair of Gheenoes on Microskiffs.com which may be helpful. There used to be a forum on CustomGheenoes.com where folks swapped lots of info but it appears to have been shut down. Good luck with your boat.
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They don,t even sell Ghenooes near me and i,m on E.Shore of Md. Bought this one new while on a vacation near Chesapeake bay bridge. Had to travel an hr. south of there then to get it. Love the little boat and useit probably more than my 20 seeark or 16 jon just because its so easy to handle. Use to run an 8 2stroke on it but when I sold my blackjack I took the 15 2 stroke off it and run that on it. 26mph w lab & myself. Thats scootin in a 15' Ghenooe! I,ll get her patched up and yes I did notice some tiny bubbles down keel line when I flipped it. As well as a bit of spider webbing.